Norwescon Clubs

As far as I really understand...

the only people officially, thats legally, that may cut some one off is a licensed bartender or owner. This comes from someone who has owned a bar for over 20 years and deals with a lot.

I know that sounds stupid, but we are getting official now a days.

I do not know in our case who counts as owner. Thats why I suggested the licensed bartenders.

Next we need more communication about those that are cut off. Stamping their drunk forehead is great, but. We need more. Is there an official person we should call. Does that job get dumped on Kyle or is that in his job description already?
And how do the rest of us know who this cut off person is? phone pics are great. Badge Numbers? Pepper Spray? Okay not the last one.

I'm asking for ideas here.

As for the 1st question, I do not know about the legality of “cutting” someone off; but I will look into it. However for the 2nd question, the answer is yes acting as the signal point of contact for all parties, and then passing any necessary info (including person) on to the rest of the parties has fallen in to the job description of our Party Liaison (who reports to me, so it is in my job description in turn). As for the how’s, I think that the picture phone plan worked well last year, and should again. As for other information, we do track people by, Name (Last, First, MI) and/or badge number; and maintain a searchable database that any of our supervisors (including our party liaison) can access.

We will also be working on some type of flyer with pictures and info on persons of interest for the parties, and will have it out the following day. But I think that if there is away that we could also have a picture phone at the door of each party, and that if one party cuts off, throws out, or has any other issue with a person; that it be sent to the other via the phones, as well as to our party liaison that would work best. Each party would need to decide how they handle the info.

Also please remember that because we have “Security” in our title and we have access to other confidential sources, we (Norwescon) cannot share any information about a person that we obtain via registration, incident reports, and several other areas. However, you are not held by the same standards, and information that we obtain from you; we (Norwescon) can share with the other parties. You also have the right to ask for someone’s name (or any other information) and if they give it to you, then you have no obligation to keep it confidential. Also you are free to take any pictures within your own space, and then to share said pictures. Also if they are going to drink in your party then you can require them to show you their ID.



In a perfect world we would get this information (in order) for anyone that is an issue (or could become one). But we live in the real world and what ever information we can get is great. Also remember that a picture is worth a thousand words.
• Last Name, First Name, MI
• Badge Number and/or badge name (if they have one)
• Race
• Sex
• DOB and/or age (DOB is best)
• Height
• Weight
• Hair Color
• Eye Color
• Hat type and color (if any)
• Coat (if any)
• Shirt
• Paints
• Shoes
Also
• Last Seen, Location
• Direction of travel
• Way?

Example:
Doe, John A. (The man) Badge #1111; W/M 01-01-1850; 5-08; 210lbs; BRN/BRN; Red Ball cap; black coat; white t-shirt; black paint; and white shoes; Last seen out side of 5139; heading for 5a; Was kicked out of party for fighting.

NEO Paradigm wrote:...the only people officially, thats legally, that may cut some one off is a licensed bartender or owner...

there's nothing that says we have to serve anyone. if we're hosting a party that has a bar, it's totally up to us if we decide not to serve someone we feel is too intoxicated.

just because we don't have a licensed bartender doesn't mean that we can't cut someone off. no one is going to tell us that we have to serve anyone... we can legally refuse servive to anyone we choose.

I thought we were talking about just speading the love in a picture message.

I am willing to do what we can to help, but remember we have a few hundred other people that are being good party attendees so we do not really have the time to fill out a report.

I say Stamp them, and picture them, set up an email acocunt with auto forward to a party rep with each group so we all get the pic. Its quick and it gets us all the infomation we need in moments.

I can't seem to find anything on the WA State Liquor Control website that pertains to who can and cannot "cut someone off" at a private party, however there are regulations and requirements for who can and cannot serve alcohol to ppl under banquet and temporary liquor licenses, so I am not sure just how far we want to delve into the issue. Personally I think it should be up to the host's of the parties and possibly a few of the groups members to decide who is obviously at the limit. However at the same time, each party should limit the number of ppl with the authority to do it.

One suggestion that might be considered would be for the groups to get together and pick up some sort of hard plastic card/badge that can be written on with permanent marker. Post someone at the entrance to the party wing, (possibly take turns between the parties) and check I.D. for anyone that wants to access the party wing. Write their badge number and name on it, and explain to them that they must have it to drink. If someone is cut off, take the badge and notify the ppl at the entrance. Those serving drinks would have to check for the badges and make sure that the name matches the con badge. No badge, no drink. No match, no drink. Change the color/shape or something each night. I dunno, just a thought.

when you get down to it, you can get in trouble for not cutting off wether you have a lisc or not. i never had one when i worked at Safeway but could get in trouble for selling to someone already intoxicated.



The hotel feels they are the only ones who iwll get in trouble.

so best to just do it.

IT has to do with reporting intoxication to the authorities and the proper steps to not be liable, etc.
If someone who is cut off is found drinking inside of an establishment that has cut them off, there are legal actions and so forth.
As far as I figure, if you drink in the hotel after being cut off at a hotel convention by a licensed bartender. The hotel must take legal action.
We need to be aware of this stuff because of how we are all Norwescon at the Double Tree. NOT Seperate entities in the laws eyes because it is the Double Trees property rented by Norwescon.

Lets do our best to get it together now and protect our right to party at Norwescon.

k... call me slow... but...

email, flyers, phone pix.... why not just someone following this guy around with a floresent yellow giant sign saying CUT OFF, that would be a SURE way people know he's cut off... or even better yet... let the people who're running the parties decide. I think I can tell intoxicated from non intoxicated. whether I'm shuffling people in and out of my room as fast as possible or sauntering through, enjoying my party, talking with people.

That's what they do in the "official" world and all, let each establishment decide on their own.

At this point, ANYONE who comes out as slovenly drunk at the con, it WILL affect the parties.. even if that person got drunk under the freakin stairs, or in their own room.

no, really.

The point is not to send the same problem drunk to every party.
I have watched the same guy go and be a problem at multiple parties.
Eventually being unwelcome at a party only serving food.
He was everywhere making everyone look bad. And got served after being cut off.
I actually had his friends physically remove him to his room.


We also need to know if drunk in the hallway is public intoxication. I am sure any officer gives leeway in that case. But that means we can't just send our drunks to the hallway. We don't know if they are going home by car or staying in the hotel.
Sadly all drunks are our drunks. And We do not count as separate entities to the hotel. Once we get separate serving permits, we will no longer be one entity in the laws eyes.

I found this on the Internets...

http://legallad.quickanddirtytips.com/legal-lad.aspx

Any steps that a host takes to ensure a safe party will help limit the host’s liability later. For example, cutting off a drunk guest will be strong evidence that the host was not recklessly encouraging the drunk guest to drink more. Taking the drunk guest’s keys away will ensure that the guest does not stumble away from the party and drive home. However, these steps do not seem to be a legal necessity, but rather a generally good idea. These steps are also, in my non-legal opinion, just good manners. Please write to Mr. Manners if you have questions about the polite way to pull drunken friends aside and discuss getting them home safely.

Sounds about right. Room parties aren't bars, but you should use common sense dealing with people who are intoxicated (cutting them off, handing them off to friends who can care for them, and so on).

Room parties aren't bars, but you should use common sense dealing with people who are intoxicated (cutting them off, handing them off to friends who can care for them, and so on).[/quote]

I totally agree and i think friendly social attitude of Norwescon has proven to do this very well. But we need to remember that the hotel rooms aren't our house and no matter how well we take care of our "Party casualties" the hotel only sees those as a problem every time it happens.

Oddly enough at con, the majority of the people who wind up getting sh** faced are the ones who don' t really drink much and kick into party mode once the con and wing 5B gets going. The experienced drunks actually become the babysitters.
All the parties should try to encourage guests to get food. I know that in middle of running everything - I forget. And I've helped out quite a few stumblers who said they just forgot to eat cause they were having too much fun.
Send them to hospitality and the food rooms. I love those parties for doing that. Don't send them the drunks, send them before so they make it threw the night. I have shoved some ones in my minions pants and shirts and sent them to ISS to eat something many times before, just to make sure they make it through the night.

A simple answer-

Talk a lawyer.

Better than any speculation or guessing game, take the hour to find an attorney who knows the exact specifications of the WA law, have him explain it to you in laymnas terms, and cal it good from there. Pay the $50 for the consultation and be done with it. Better to know for sure than guess and be unlucky.

It's better than any speculation, hypothesis, or "we got lucky but we do this" any day.

~Sean

I have two.

And I have spoken with the Double Tree's.

Not much of application has occurred in Washington.

Talk with the Liquor Board official for the area! I am working on finding out a time we can both meet and clarify a few things.